The long and bloody Montreal mafia war along with the efforts of law enforcement has left the Rizzuto crime family crippled and the mafia in Montreal in a state of total destabilization according to police sources.
Head of the organized crime unit of the SPVM Major Nicodemo Milano said in a new Journal de Montreal report that “There is currently no willingness, either internally or externally, to take the leadership of the traditional Italian organized crime.” The Montreal mafia was ruled by the Rizzuto family and boss Vito Rizzuto for the last couple of decades but the void created by his 2013 death has yet to be filled. So far those attempting to take control or have expressed an interest in taking over even on an interim basis have done so at their own peril.
Rizzuto family loyalists have tried to maintain control of the Montreal underworld throughout the conflict but have lacked the power and influence needed to resist rival factions and or law enforcement. A mafia leadership table was formed shortly after Rizzuto’s death led by his son Leonardo Rizzuto and Stefano Sollecito but the newly formed administration was short-lived. It dissolved after the arrest of both Leonardo and Stefano in operation Magot-Mastiff. With Stefano faces both legal and health problems his father and Rizzuto family ally Rocco Sollecito stepped in as an interim leader for a short time before being gunned down. Another former power within the Rizzuto family Lorenzo Giordano expressed an interest in becoming the new Montreal mob boss but was also killed shortly after his release from prison.
It’s clear the Rizzuto family has lost its long-held grip on organized crime in Montreal and things have now become so unstable that no one seems to be interested in stepping in to fill the power vacuum that has developed. According to sources influential mafioso, Liborio Cuntrera who was just released from cocaine trafficking charges and whose father was a Rizzuto family leader has no interest in taking control. One time Rizzuto family acting boss Francesco Arcadi was returned to prison for his own safety after the death or Giordano now seems like an unlikely option. The powerful Calabrian-based Ontario mafia group which includes the new generation of the Cotroni and Violi families which once controlled the mafia in Montreal and are believed to at least in part be behind the recent attack on the Rizzuto family also seems unwilling to step in and take control according to sources.
The new leaders of Italian organized crime would not only have to deal with the instability within its own organization but also other criminal organizations which may be poised to take advantage like the Hells Angels. The powerful MC is making a comeback after Operation SharQc failed to deliver the major blow it was intended to due to various judicial problems. Influential Hells Angel leaders are making their way back to the streets after shorter than expected prison sentences and Milano notes they certainly do not intend to release their control of the narcotics market. It has been 60 years since the Montreal mafia was without a godfather and now it seems like no one wants to take the crown. Perhaps the days of an all powerful godfather in Montreal have come and gone and the once traditional dynamic is changing. Or perhaps the real power behind the dismantling of the Rizzuto family and the potential new godfather has simply not stepped out of the shadows yet.
It definitely seems like things have gotten out of control up there and I am not sure anyone thought it would go this far. What is left of the Rizzuto’s don’t seem to want to fold and yet don’t seem to have anyone who can keep control esp with Stefano sick and with a lot of legal problems yet the rival faction that has taken it to them als doesn’t seem to be able to take control of things. Maybe the war against the Rizzuto’s was all about revenge and not so much a complete power grab and now that things are so crazy the Calabrians etc are hesitant to completely step in. I dunno I think someone will step up before long and take the reigns because if no one does there is a whole lot to lose.
The fact that these guys have been knocking each other off for the last several years with legal impunity suggests that the Mafia is still very powerful in Canada. I wouldn’t give any of the credit for the weakening of the Montreal Mafia to law enforcement. Putting a bunch of guys in jail doesn’t necessarily hurt the Mafia. The only thing that truly hurts the Mob are rats, of which there seems to be none north of the border.
who turns the mobster into a rat ? who catches them while they are smuggling/dealing drugs and are looking at 40 years .. mobsters don’t suddenly wake up one day and think they should change their ways lol
I don’t think I said anything about mobsters waking up one day and deciding to suddenly change their ways, but I’ll double check my comment.
law enforcement put pressure on the weak mobsters to turn them into rats.. your comment before suggests law enforcement has no role in the matter… but please edit your comment if you want
I’m saying that law enforcement doesn’t have a lot to do with the weakening of the Montreal Mafia it’s more to do with their enemies picking them off. If law enforcement was so effective in Canada then they wouldn’t be knocking each other off nearly as much like in America you don’t see guys getting whacked as much as the old days because they don’t want to face murder charges when they get indicted.
Fact is you can kill someone in Canada and plead it down enough to end up serving between 5-9 years. I’ve had friends serve under 9 years for murder. Our legal system is a joke. It’s a paradise for crooks. Our jails are also very very different than American jails.
In Ontario if you take a pinch where you’re looking at time, you’ll advise your lawyer to get you two years plus a day rather than two years less a day because that’s the deciding factor of if your serving your sentence federally or provincially.. NO ONE wants to serve provincial time. Fed time is relaxed.
its very rare for somebody to get 5-9 years for murder in canada i never heard of that happening.. secondly i don“t no if you have ever done time buts its not such a cake walk i spent 1.6 in Bordeaux and i can tell you it was the shittiest time of my life …..
normally people that never done time wanna talk about how it easy it is.
I know two people one served 9 and the other served just over five both for dumbed down pleads in murder cases. One finished his sentence in donnaconna actually even though it happened in Toronto.
And yes I have at maplehurst. Never said it was a cake walk in any way- said fed time
Is more relaxed, which I haven’t done but it’s commonly known guys are calmer when they know it’s a longer stretch
No body wants to do 23 months provincially much rather extra time to do it federally- not sure if that attitude applies in Quebec but sure does in Ontario
Jimmy Demaria shot a guy in the back like 7 times over a debt and tried to plead self defence…. despite it being in the back. Also in broad day light I believe on college street. I’m 90% he did under a decade.
He’s on lifetime parole and they violate him almost every single
Time he’s caught meeting with anyone etc but still
Known ‘ndrangheta boss, sits on the camera di controllo, convicted murderer and still wakes up in a mansion in Mississauga and not a cell.
That’s Canada
example of two people your not even sure of all the details. you have no idea what goes on behind closed doors maybe these guys informed for a lesser sentence who knows. you get convicted of 1st degree murder your going away for 25.
I do know exact details but I’m not posting the case file of two guys I know personally on the internet
25 years in Canada is pretty uncommon. Asian dude who cut the innocent kids head off out west did less and is out already. 25 years is rare, period.
of coure law enforcement has alot to do with weaking of the mob. project colisee, and arresting rizzuto left the door wide open for other clans to challenge the rizzutos. recently there has been alot of busts that have put alot of key guys in prison
My point is that in Canada they are being killed off far more than they are being locked up. In America it’s the opposite.
thtas not even true. there has been 30sh mob murders. in the last 7 years. far more mobsters have been locked in that time. operation colisse alone theer was over 80 guys got locked up
all these murders is a sign of the instability created by the top guys getting busted back in 06
80 guys got locked up, but how many of those 80 guys are doing serious time? I bet most of those guys were back on the streets in no time. That’s what people don’t realize about these massive busts, just because a few hundred guys get rounded up doesn’t mean that most or even half will do serious time.
Difference is that when you take a racketeering or drug etc charge in the US you’re facing an obnoxious amount of time, which is part of the reason more guys flip. Also in Canada you rarely serve your full sentence, and to actually serve life you need to be classed dangerous offender or even more rare involuntary commitment which is usually for mental health cases
What were the sentences in colisee even? Tops a decade? Meaning probably 8 years at most. Not to mention those guys typically don’t get poor treatment in lock up they are usually idolized. Short of Peter scarcella getting stabbed in jail I don’t know of too many mob guys having issues in jail
delbaso, arcadi, gioderano, all did between 10 and 12 years. Coppa of the bonnanos ratted when he was facing 6. peopleforget Rizzuto plead out in the bonnano murders and only did 6 years in colorado super max. 6 years for conspiracy in 3 murders pretty good deal.
my point is some of these top guys get with 10 and 15 year sentences. yes in canada you can get parol at the 3/4 mark however you still have tight restrictions. 8-9 years in prison is no cake walk. i just think the Rizzutos have been the only game in town for 3 decades and are a very strong, loyal organisation.
Is that not an example of exactly what you’re attempting to argue with me about?
‘Guys never get 5-9 for murder’
‘Rizzuto did 6 years for involvement in a triple murder’
Not sure I quite get it
your Saying canada is soft , im saying Rizzuto got six years in the States for conspiracy Colorado is in the US.
theres chances to plead down in any country. and u keep mixing up the facts the asian was criminally insane.
I’m not mixing up any facts, we are drawing comparisons between the US and Canadian legal systems.
Some of the posts back and forth may have been a bit convoluted because we were discussing multiple things at once. But ultimately, again, for simplicity, Canada is much less punitive than the United States, and thats undeniable and has been since the dawn of both of our legal systems.
i 100% agree Canada is far less punitive then US not even close. my original point was against Clinton who is arguing that Canadian law enforcement has nothing or almost nothing to do with the decline of the mob in Canada. im arguing that colisee and arrest of Rizzuto (although by us law enforcement) and the more recent bust forget name of the operation has greatly reduced the mob and is one of the main reasons why there is decline in 2017. if it wasnt for theres bust that destabilized the sicilians the door would never have been opened for the other clans to make the challenge.
i think were saying close to the same thing
I agree, I think Colisee and the imprisonment of Vito was putting some of the last nails in the coffin as far as a unified and stable organization in Montreal, at least for a time. Vito even told the cops driving him to be deported that it would be a mistake and he was the only one who could keep relative calm.
Not to say permanently. Montreal has a massive Italian population, not to mention a constant stream of other capable ethnic crooks including quebecois, is notorious for political corruption and collusion. Once the dust settles its very possible they reassert their dominance.
yes, i think right now by all report HA is dominating organised crime in Montreal. and untill the italians stop this war that will remain the case.
The one thing the Italians have and always probably will, is that people want to deal with them because of their reputation for sophistication and business acumen. No crooked MP, or lawyer, or any other guy who spent his life behind books rather than on the street wants to go to a meeting with a group of Hells Angels, guys generally regarded as motorcycle riding tough guys.
So the italians will always be the criminal element with the best connections into the legitimate world, which is where the power really is. Of course there is money in any and all vices, but long standing power comes from what they had (prior to the charbonneau commission uncovering it), which were deep ties into infrastructure. Construction, politics etc.,
Olympic stadium fell a part for a reason lol…. time cards showed X amount of cement dump trucks making the rounds while constructing the stadium, which i’m sure they did… some how i just doubt they dropped off cement each time.
the mob in Montreal is still a top organisation no doubt just in the last years they have lost power as compared to what they once had. (arrested, charbonneau commission, war) i think they can climb back to the top but i doubt they are gonna be as powerful as they once where….
Its true, but history shows us when one group is toppled, it can lead way for another more powerful group to take over. The Rizzutos absolutely eclipsed the Cotroni’s in every imaginable way, after taking out who they had to and forcing some into retirement. It seems now that allowing some of the Cotroni loyalists to stay alive or to remain involved in the organization may have been a mistake… even decades later….Moreno Gallo, Joe Di Maulo, etc.,
For the sake of simplicity, yes, in terms of comparing prison conditions in either country.
Would rather serve time in Millhaven or Stony Mountain etc than ADX florence or really any SHU in the US.
THATS for sure LOL
But overall Canada is regarded by many as a being a better place to live than America, so perhaps having the Mafia around isn’t such a bad thing.
Also, I don’t hear much about wiseguys getting poor treatment in the American prison system. The ones who rat their way out of prison just simply don’t want to do the time, plain and simple. Hell, in general mobsters don’t get sent to the really hardcore, violent prisons anyway.
seriously your telling me guys like vinny basancio did not have poor treatment in prison? he got treated as if he was a terrorist I know of guys nearly dying inside because of the lack of treatment they get look at sally KO Larca he could hardly breathe and was really sick for months they did nothing left him there only actually gave him treatment and even that i heard they fucked up when he was bleeding everywhere and he nearly died and apparently his body will never be the same its a f*****g disgrace dident even tell his family while he was in pain and getting treated said they couldent see him because of “security” reasons he is in his 40s made guy in Genovese family he is suing the government now
are you serious guys get busted federally are going to super max prisons they spend 23hours in there cells. absolutly not true what you said
This is the depiction in movies in the mobs hey day (i.e. goodfellas)…Back in the days where they had Mafia Rows (I believe the most famous and widely known was at Lewisburg), ranges separated to accommodate the mob guys.
What the mafia said below is much more accurate in present day.
I am talking about not being treated poorly by fellow inmates, not the prison system itself.
I think things will take a turn towards a model more similar to Ontario, where there are various clans existing within the city that occasionally work together but have no formal hierarchy to kick up tribute to etc except that within their own clan.
It’s a more modern approach, much more autonomous cells coexisting. In Toronto there are seven ‘ndrangheta clans alone, and a board (camera di controllo, similar to the commission) exists to resolve conflicts and other disputes. Toronto has never really had a single all powerful godfather, like say a Carlo Gambino figure. Some like to say Paul volpe was the closest thing to it but that’s a bit dramatized. Volpe was a street guy who only decided to seek out getting made after he realized his progress would be stunted and he couldn’t protect himself in disputes with guys like Johnny pops and violi/cotroni. It was more of a means for survival (not that it worked). He ran a crew of non Italians in Toronto.
Montreal, historically, was subservient to the New York families, so therefore forced to adopt their structure ie boss underboss capos soldiers and so on. But these guys came over from the other side, that wasn’t the traditional structure in Calabria, which a lot of them were. Over time, the American control weakened to a point where the rizzutos were more powerful and organized by a long shot than the bonnanos, but Vito appeased them for decades not out of fear but because it was the easier route. Why create enemies? Now that New York has very little say in matters in Montreal, and without the cohesive nature and mystique of Vito rizzuto, all of the younger clans that had been unhappy kicking up to an administration of old guard guys decided to revolt. Natural progression.
Another thing to keep in mind is it isn’t always clear who is on whose side. There were rizzuto guys that defected blatantly to other groups ie de vito, but there were some who sat on the fence ie Johnny bravo, then some plainly tried to play both sides. The recent spay of mob murders in Toronto, I haven’t figured those out yet. There is of course a connection across the board. The problem is, the Toronto media some times won’t release the names of the targets, so you either have to hear it on the street or from journalists speaking on terms of anonymity.
What has surprised me is the lack of involvement of Peter scarcella, or other Sicilians in Toronto. They are traditionally aligned with rizzuto, yet it doesn’t seem like they’re offering much support. I think the theory that it’s the sons of violi is a bit far fetched, I don’t think Hamilton has the clout or manpower. I think it’s a coalition of street gangs/ other non made guys and a couple clans paying them to do the hits (which have been surprisingly professional, for the most part).
I think the days of the consortium in Montreal are done. I think the angels will want to sit at a table on equal footing with the Italians and the Irish, and street gangs will either resort to immense violence for their piece or they will fall in line. And what we will ultimately see is a variety of clans operating in relative peace with no real ‘boss of bosses’ figure, like Vito. Similar to toronto in the sense that there is no real boss of a single family, but the leader of the most powerful clan (commisso) is deferred to to some extent.
Another thing to keep in mind is that Vito not really acknowledged being a decina, not a family, at least to the bonnano administration. He only considered 15-20 guys officially ‘made’ (albeit that was probably over a decade ago or more), but the rest of these guys weren’t all necessary considered members of the organization but more so underlings, but not in the same sense as what New Yorks model would consider an ‘associate’, more powerful and respect than that. It’s always been a murky hierarchy.
If anyone was going to be boss when the smoke settled for the Sicilian camp it likely would’ve been domenico manno. I think both arcadi and del balso likely have targets on their backs, but have to consider del balso was a leader in a faction of younger up and comers who deferred to the old guard but probably resented kicking up, and Arcadi is a Calabrian so his loyalty could stay with his blood.
On another note, also have to remember the murkier it is on the street, the murkier it will be for informants and law enforcement, hence why in Canada organizations arent constantly hit with enterprise corruption (gangsterism, our rico) charges that bring down a huge chunk of a families heavy hitters. It’s a blur, so often times they’ll snag one two or three guys, but the organization remains fluid.
Short of collisee (bad, bad timing) and magot/mastiff, law enforcement typically arrests one or two guys here and there and nothing is destabilized.
Admin I just wrote like six paragraphs and it’s deleted??
Thanks for the comments and input Tommy. Sorry about the deleted text as I have checked with in the moderator back end and cannot find any reason for it or any record of the rest of the text that remains.
Too bad as I probably won’t spend the time to rewrite it lol it was a short novel
http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/loreto-funeral-complex-arson-1.4084176
Thanks for link cedz!
rizzuto funeral home firebombed this morning
Also, no innocent bystanders have been killed in Canada, which is so common in America. That could be another factor.
Not entirely true. During the biker wars (which Vito helped end) an 11 year old boy was killed intentionally in a bomb attack, two correctional officers also targeted.
Two innocent people murdered June 24 2015 or 16 I forget in Woodbridge cafe gambling den attack. Recently a 28 year old girl killed in Woodbridge sitting in the passenger seat during a targeted hit and the guy survived.
People just don’t rat nearly as much in this country. Ratting is a retirement plan in the US.
I think you hit it right on the head with that last statement Tommy .. “Ratting is a retirement plan in the US” that is quite true now a days when it comes to the American Mob especially.
ratting is not as bad as the media portrays it in the US if you look at the amount of guys who have actually flipped in the last ten years the number is a lot smaller than most realize nearly all of these guys do there time without ratting but that never gets attention its only when they flip and like I said before its a very small number who do especially last 5 years one made guy has flipped
Canada does have a lot less rats I do agree with that but to suggest ratting is a “retirement plan” in the US is not true
Your right it is not as bad as it seems to be as compared to over all numbers. BUT the mind set is not the same anymore and you can bet guys (more than a few) have it in the back of their minds that if they get pinched and it something big they have that “rat” get out of jail free card they can use if needed and in that way it is somewhat of a get out the life retirement option if not a plan per say.
I am not disputing that I agree the mindset has changed the and like I have said many times on this site the old “life” is dead the mafia what it once was in the 70s and 80s does not exist anymore and its never coming back todays mafia has become something different guys today can flip knowing they will never be killed and live there life without ever having to worry about getting killed once the programme was created and the commission was taken down it was the beginning of the end
Yea one made guy but how many dozens of associates and such have flipped? Enough for Trevor McDonald to make a mini series about it.
End of the day nearly any time an indictment with anything heavy comes down in the US, what is the first thing everyone expects? Who is gonna rat. And more times than not it proves that at least some guys do.
The five families are an absolute shadow of their former selves and that’s undeniable, a lot of which is directly attributable to guys cooperating. Some guys take like three four five days locked up before they make their decision to join team America, it’s pathetic.
Eventually it’s gotta get to a point where the government can’t even offer deals anymore because they already know everything. When you have these fourth and fifth generation so called ‘italians’ who were raised American and spoiled as shit their whole lives, the inside of a cell is terrifying so they take deals as fast as they can.
the guys trevor did an interview with flipped over 15 years ago so they are irrelevant plus he had one real wiseguy on his show scars the others are nobodies (I am including previte in that fat fuck). I disagree with that it used to be like that but with the lack of murders less guys are flipping when indictments come down your thinking of the mafia of the early 2000s times have changed now the rats in these big indictments are guys who flipped before the bust and wore a wire like you said are associates they are not the same as a real wiseguy flipping.
I agree with you its not even a shadow of itself its dead then mafia people think of is what they see in films like the goodfellas that life does not exist anymore the mafia of today has become something else. And I am not suggesting rats are not a problem or one of the main reasons for the downfall of the mafia but the problem today is not even close to what your saying the problem is it only takes ONE guy to cause a lot of damage look at the recent Merlino bust there was one rat in that case and a couple of civilians who were getting extorted by the Genovese family in Springfield that’s it one guy caused most of those guys to get indicted he was even able to bring in a FBI agent.
Three or four days please give me a name lol I know of guys getting busted with drugs and then flipping on the spot because they know they are fucked but normally guys who get busted in big indicments and then flip take a few months for reality to hit.
As for the kids today I agree a lot of them are a joke and they will be the downfall of the LCN not all are idiots there is some young guys who are stand up and intelligent but they are not the same of the guys of the old days. The ratting problem Is also not even close to what it was like in the 90s back then it was a epidemic these days its not as bad and that’s because less people are getting killed
Rats are no where near as bad as they used to be, and its true there arent as many new flips like there used to be.I think a major change in LCN now is that we are seeing more Zips coming over from Italy. No where near as much as they did 100 years ago but the Mafia in America needs to replenish its ranks with fresh blood. Old school kind of guys who stay out of the public eyes in the modern day. At least thats what I’ve heard.
could also be where not seeing as many LARGE scale mafia busts as we did in the 80`s and 90`s. even the EAST coast cosa nostra case. probably the biggest mafia bust recently. theres no murder or large scale drug trafficking that could lead to life or huge sentences that would incite people to rat… just a thought
But there’s also been plenty of cases where guys weren’t looking at very much time or the evidence was very weak and people still ratted. And the East Coast LCN case did have a rat, and that rat is one of the main reasons it’s falling apart. Maybe the whole rat thing is just not as effective as it once was. The glory days of the rats may be over. It’s not the great retirement plan it once was.
as mentioned by several people namely MF theirs has not been any major made guys Ratting in quite some time……..
the whole zips coming over has not really been told properly mainly because of poor reporting. There has not been this sudden increase of zips no more now than there was 20 years ago the difference now is that for the first time members of the Siclian factions of the Gambino family have made it to the top mainly because the other strong (and more violent) factions within the family like the Gottis and Corezzos have been taken down or weakened by the FBI. I also have to say this because I see it all the time Frank Cali is not a zip he grew up here he married the right daughter and has good blood relatives that’s how he has the position.
However I do have to stress this has only effected the Gambino family the other four familys have not seen new Zip leaderships. Only other family in New York which argubably has a “zip” faction like the Gambinos is the Bonanno family but none of those guys are in a leadership position and while we are on the “zip” faction of the Gambino family people need to remember this is a small minority who are “zips”
As for new members its easier said than done I see this a lot on these sites people say why don’t they bring over some zips it doesn’t really work like that these are people remember most of these guys have no intention of ever moving to the US why would they? its not the 80s anymore the days of the pizza connection are dead. At the moment its the same old kids today joining most of the guys getting involved today have some sort of blood relative involved Hope I have explained ths
I still think that we will see more Italian mobsters from Italy and Sicily popping up in America and even filling the thinning ranks of LCN. Only time will tell.
why would Sicilian mobsters want to come over? they have no reason you make it seem like they would want to come over why they don’t speak the language and would be joining an organization where they don’t know the people in this day and age full of rats its too much of risk. The drug dealing is not like it was in the 80s with the pizza connection I have not seen this sudden increase in zips its just poor reporting I actually thinks its the opposite there is less zips today than there was 20 years ago . Its also very hard for these guys to actually get into the country it would be very unlikely in this day and age for them to get a green card they are risking getting deported why bother not worth the risks and the money is not even close to what they make in Sicily its not the 70s people
Very fair point. Ive really only heard it from my cousin who recently came over from Sicily. But your right there is no really good reason for Mafiosi from sicily to come here. And with that being said, one day the itailan mafia in america will have to either END, or no longer induct just italians if they cant get younger members into the ranks. Granted I dont believe we will see that in our lifetime of course.
We’ve seen it already in our life time. The rules just get bent for the right people, or in times of need. These guys break more rules than they enforce, keep in mind its a society built on the premise of breaking rules.
In Canada we’ve had Juan Ramon Fernandez (spanish origin) made, and Reynald Desjardin (french canadian) made, both personally by Vito. Some people dispute it because Fernandez was later killed in Sicily (by two guys who both lived in Toronto for quite a while), because he was insisting to be regarded as a made man by the locals in Sicily, but the reality is he was killed because he didn’t choose a side in the war.
Also, isn’t john gotti JR half russian or something? And John Veasey of Philly, made by stanfa, who was supposedly an old school sicilian, was apparently also made. Tommy D of philly was half polish I think. James Marcello of the outfit was half irish I think.
So ya all the rules get broken.
I apologize. What I mean by in our lifetime is the Mafia in America cease to be all together.
I think another thing people fail to realize is Zips completely running things nearly impossible. Part of the life these guys choose leads to quite a few issues with police and not being American citizens they would be getting deported left and right if there were more of them. Making themselves larger targets by rising in rank also highly increases likelihood of serious charges followed by prison then deportation.
Geez I had no idea that there were that many innocent bystanders hit but I still think that organized crime in Canada are better at hitting their targets. And that last statement is very true I couldn’t say it better. Ratting is definitely a retirement plan it sure seems like most of those guys plan it years before they take the leap.
You assume they re better at hitting their targets. When do they constantly kill innocent bystanders in America? You “had no idea” yet “still think”.
I’ve been reading about this subject for long enough to know that far more innocent bystanders are killed here than in Canada. Not to mention there’s more attempted hits than actual killings in America.
Such as when??? Name a few incidents where they killed innocent bystanders